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[2:16] <marvinstuart> I am running raspbian on model b pi and getting when running mono
[2:16] <marvinstuart> http://pastebin.com/uVgrHWVi
[2:16] <marvinstuart> Can someone help
[2:16] * daveee123 (~daveee123@ip-209-203.oberlin.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[2:18] <marvinstuart> Ay takers
[2:18] <marvinstuart> Any
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[2:22] <marvinstuart> Hello
[2:22] <marvinstuart> Over 200 user and no one talking
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[2:27] <marvinstuart> Hello
[2:27] * pi1 is now known as slystone
[2:30] <marvinstuart> Hey pi1
[2:31] <marvinstuart> Slystone: could you help me
[2:31] <plugwash> mono is known to be badly broken on raspbian
[2:32] <marvinstuart> Of
[2:32] <marvinstuart> Oh
[2:32] <plugwash> we are hoping to get a fix in eventually but the fix is for a newer version of mono and there is no debian packaging available for that version yet
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[2:32] <marvinstuart> Ok what distro you suggest in the interim
[2:33] <marvinstuart> For the pi
[2:33] <marvinstuart> With a working mono
[2:33] <plugwash> debian armel
[2:33] <Gallomimia> what's good for playing music on raspbian?
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[2:34] <marvinstuart> Thank you
[2:36] <aidalgol> Why is mono broken?
[2:36] <aidalgol> I thought it was pretty stable.
[2:36] <aidalgol> Or does it have arch-specific code in it?
[2:36] <gnarface> mono? stable
[2:36] <gnarface> hahahaha
[2:37] <aidalgol> guess that's just marketing's reality-distortion field :P
[2:37] <gnarface> even microsoft is trying to strangle that shit stain project in its cradle now
[2:37] <marvinstuart> Plugwash: can you send me a link to debian armel installation pi
[2:38] <aidalgol> marvinstuart: I'd just avoid using mono for now. Debian armel doesn't have as good hardware support (AIUI) as raspbian.
[2:38] <marvinstuart> Hmm
[2:38] <marvinstuart> Wow
[2:39] <aidalgol> gnarface: I've never understood why anyone chooses to use C# when the non-MS implementation(s) are always behind.
[2:39] <aidalgol> And were more for compatibility to begin with.
[2:40] <marvinstuart> The only purpose of me getting the raspberrypi was to run a program through mono called missionplanner aka ardupilot
[2:40] <gnarface> aidalgol: i finally did but in order to do it you have to stop listening to the justifications they're voicing and start reading between the lines to get at the dogma they're not speaking of. warning: once you figure it out you'll probably get mad, if you work in the same department.
[2:40] <marvinstuart> So I don't have a choice
[2:41] <aidalgol> marvinstuart: In that case, go ahead.
[2:41] <marvinstuart> Cool
[2:41] <gnarface> marvinstuart: well you have choices, but patience in this case is probably the best option. wheezy just isn't ready yet. raspbian will be ready shortly after it.
[2:41] <marvinstuart> Hmm what time frame days week or months
[2:41] <gnarface> that is probably a question for the mono maintainer...
[2:41] <aidalgol> gnarface: fanboyism?
[2:42] <aidalgol> "Industry Best Practise" BS from people with pointy hair?
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[2:43] <gnarface> aidalgol: that's a really nice way to phrase "corporate espionage" but basically that's what it boils down to yea; the base assumption that microsoft's products are the source of their success and that success can rub off when you smear it on your face.
[2:43] <marvinstuart> I looked on the rpi list and I don't see armel http://elinux.org/RPi_Distributions
[2:44] * gnarface just wants to know how much money Miguel was paid under the table by Microsoft before they realized he named it after a sexually transmitted disease
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[2:45] <marvinstuart> Anymore suggestion from the list to use mono http://elinux.org/RPi_Distributions
[2:45] <plugwash> The foundation have a debian armel image available for download from from http://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads , it's a bit older than their raspbian image though
[2:45] <marvinstuart> Ok
[2:45] <marvinstuart> Thank plug
[2:46] <gnarface> i thought the debian image *is* their armel port...
[2:46] <gnarface> they marged them into one, didn't they?
[2:46] <gnarface> you won't get hardware floating point though.
[2:46] <plugwash> Yes the foundation's debian image is and always has been armel
[2:46] <gnarface> that's the difference between this thing being as useful as a pentium 3 or not
[2:47] <plugwash> debian armhf won't run on the Pi
[2:47] <plugwash> hence why raspbian exists
[2:47] <sney> I just nuked my sd card, apparently.
[2:47] <gnarface> happens
[2:47] <sney> but I suspect it was on its way out, and apt-get update was all it needed to fully die
[2:47] <kais58> s/run/reliably run/ fixed that for you ;)
[2:47] <plugwash> debian armhf isn't going to run on the Pi period
[2:48] <sney> kais58, it was my understanding that armv7 hf wouldn't even boot.
[2:48] <marvinstuart> Plugwash: use the Arch Linux ARM right
[2:48] <kais58> sorry, packages dont reliably run
[2:48] <plugwash> marvinstuart, the arch image is hardfloat too nowadays so I suspect they have the same mono problems raspbian has
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[2:49] <sney> I hope I can recover my sd card, rather not have to buy a new one. I use that pi as my irc bouncer. what a pain.
[2:49] <marvinstuart> The which image you suggest
[2:49] <plugwash> kais58, AIUI pretty much any native code built on debian armhf will die immediately on a Pi
[2:50] <kais58> plugwash: ok, I was misinformed
[2:50] <plugwash> so the only way a package from debian armhf would work is either if it was built with an unusual compiler or if it didn't actually contain any native code
[2:51] <marvinstuart> Plug wash: which one do you think will work with mono if arch or raspbian will not work
[2:51] <sney> debian armel, probably
[2:51] <kais58> anyway, marvinstuart: if you want mono now, debian armel, if you want it to be fast, wait for proper release
[2:52] <marvinstuart> Kais58: please send me a link to an image off Debian armel
[2:52] <marvinstuart> I can't find one
[2:52] <gnarface> marvinstuart: the only debian link on that page links right to it
[2:53] <gnarface> marvinstuart: http://www.debian.org/ports/arm/
[2:53] <gnarface> marvinstuart: you gotta at least READ the links
[2:53] <plugwash> http://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads second entry
[2:53] <kais58> its on that page plugwash linked to you, called soft-float dbian "wheezy"
[2:54] <marvinstuart> Soft float
[2:54] <marvinstuart> Ok thank you guys
[2:54] <marvinstuart> Going to get it done
[2:54] <plugwash> kais58, just tried building hello world in c on debian armhf and then copied it to a pi and ran it, instant segfault
[2:56] <gnarface> marvinstuart: move a bit slower, pay a bit more attention. you seem right now like you're going to trip and fall on your face.
[2:57] <gnarface> the raspberry pi is about patience
[2:57] <gnarface> :)
[2:57] <marvinstuart> Yeah
[2:57] <marvinstuart> Just testing will come back to raspbian
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[2:59] <gnarface> there's no way to get a boot menu on the raspberry pi is there?
[2:59] <gnarface> can you dual-boot without swapping SD cards?
[3:00] <gnarface> or do you still have to at least change kernel command-line options manually?
[3:00] <kais58> I'm sure you could get a boot loader to work on one
[3:00] * gnarface can barely get grub to work on hardware it supports
[3:01] <aidalgol> What non-Linux OSes run on the r-pi (aside from RISC OS)?
[3:01] <aidalgol> Let's port FreeDOS to ARM!
[3:01] <gnarface> i wasn't aware there was any others and RISC OS didn't look even remotely useful to me
[3:01] <aidalgol> gnarface: That doesn't surprise me.
[3:02] <gnarface> but marvinstuart's conundrum raises a valid point; it may be useful to keep a regular debian distro around too, for cases where raspbian's hard float implementation is problematic for compatibliity
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[3:03] <aidalgol> I never thought floating-point support in hardware would be the cause of software problems.
[3:03] <plugwash> riscos is nostalgic to people my age in the UK who grew up with it in schools but i'm not convinced it's all that useful beyond that
[3:03] <marvinstuart> Gnarface: Ok I will use another sd card for testing
[3:04] <plugwash> iirc there are also ports of freebsd and plan 9 now
[3:04] <gnarface> oh i like plan 9 a lot
[3:04] <gnarface> i really wished i could have figured out how to do something useful with it
[3:04] <gnarface> maybe i'll try booting that
[3:04] <plugwash> aidalgol, the problem isn't the hardware floating point itself, its the hard float abi that raspbian uses, this abi is more efficient (no need to move stuff to integer registers before passing parameters) but not all software is ready for it yet
[3:04] <plugwash> debian armhf has the same problem
[3:04] <gnarface> i heard they're working on porting haiku to arm, but i don't know if that intends to include raspberry pi hard float support
[3:05] <gnarface> haiku seems like it would be ideal really
[3:05] <gnarface> if you wanted to use your raspberry pi as a desktop/laptop/tablet at least
[3:05] <aidalgol> plugwash: I thought you only need to rebuild software to use a new ABI, with exceptions for low-level code.
[3:05] <plugwash> aidalgol, yeah, low level code like mono :(
[3:06] <plugwash> and java
[3:06] <gnarface> aidalgol: i think that this constitutes low-level code for sure.
[3:06] <plugwash> and other such vm implementation
[3:06] <aidalgol> Oh, right: VMs.
[3:06] <gnarface> aidalgol: keep in mind that mono isn't *fundamentally* different than wine - so expect THOSE types of compatibility issues
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[3:07] <plugwash> honestly though I think that in a few years time the hard float abi is likely to be better supported than the soft float one.
[3:07] <gnarface> really any 3d games optimized for hardware acceleration would have the same issue too
[3:07] <gnarface> i imagine its got to catch up
[3:08] <gnarface> there's so much demand for low power devices now
[3:08] <gnarface> but i believe that they even had to fork quake3 to get it to run nice on the pi
[3:08] <gnarface> (nice-ish)
[3:09] <plugwash> I think the quake3 thing was more about making it work with the Pi's version of opengl es than anything processor related
[3:09] <plugwash> but I may be wrong
[3:09] <kais58> thats the problem with most graphical things on pi though
[3:09] <plugwash> yeah :(
[3:09] <gnarface> plugwash: eh... opengl es 2.0, maybe. but doesn't that *essentially* boil down to a hardware implementation difference just like the floating point component?
[3:10] <gnarface> just one in the video card instead of in the cpu
[3:10] <gnarface> but on the pi they're not even a separate chip, are they?
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[3:11] <kais58> the fact its on the same chip makes no real difference on a implmentation level
[3:11] <gnarface> supposedly e17 supports the raspberry pi's opengl, but the raspbian package doesn't appear to have been compiled to use it
[3:11] <gnarface> er, doesn't appaear to be linked to the gl libraries that is
[3:13] <plugwash> AIUI you have to use a Pi specific method to get the opengl es context
[3:13] <plugwash> at least that is what I heard a while back, dunno if things have changed
[3:14] <gnarface> well, i certainly did when building quake3
[3:14] <gnarface> so that would make sense
[3:14] <gnarface> but i was kinda surprised someone hadn't already done it and put it in raspians' repos
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[3:14] <gnarface> also i was kinda surprised that the libraries you need aren't included in build-essential
[3:15] <gnarface> so i had to figure them out and install them manually in addition to build-essential
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[3:20] <gnarface> removing journaling made ext4 a lot faster on the cheap flash card i used, but isn't it long past time for us to have journaling-filesystem-safe flash?
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[3:29] <- *XenGi* Sry I'm currently not present but you can leave me a message and I will probably respond to it.
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[6:33] * mythos (~mythos@chello080109227218.1.uni-klu.teleweb.at) Quit (Disconnected by services)
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[6:56] * Lupinedk is now known as lupinedk
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[7:22] * monkeycoder (~monkeycod@37.215.151.127) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[7:32] * aidalgol (~user@114-134-6-184.rurallink.co.nz) has joined #raspbian
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[7:54] * vagrantc (~vagrant@freegeek/vagrantc) Quit (Quit: leaving)
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[8:20] * raspier (~raspier@5.44.248.21) Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
[8:22] * twolife` is now known as twolife
[8:26] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[8:33] * mattronix (~nlmfr@83.232.98.133) has joined #raspbian
[8:33] <mattronix> hello
[8:41] * tinti (~tinti@201.62.162.119) has joined #raspbian
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[9:58] * creemj (~mjc@60-234-221-162.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) Quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
[10:02] * Datalink|Elsewhe is now known as Datalink
[10:24] * gordonDrogon (~gordon@watertower.drogon.net) Quit (Quit: Where's the Kaboom?)
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[10:45] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) Quit ()
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[10:54] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) Quit ()
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[11:03] <Adya> Hi guys
[11:03] <Adya> I've just installed pibang and I've got desktop like this: http://i.imgur.com/uilYC.jpeg
[11:03] <Adya> What should I do?
[11:03] * Holden (~holden@unaffiliated/holdenc) has joined #raspbian
[11:04] * trijntje (~quassel@ubuntu/member/trijntje) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
[11:05] * trijntje (~quassel@ubuntu/member/trijntje) has joined #raspbian
[11:05] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) has joined #raspbian
[11:05] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) Quit (Client Quit)
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[11:05] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) Quit (Client Quit)
[11:06] * TeraX (TeraX@2a01:360:101:0:219:b9ff:fefd:d5c2) has joined #raspbian
[11:08] <Adya> ANYBODY HERE?)
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[11:14] * monkeycoder (~monkeycod@37.17.115.246) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:14] * Datalink (~Datalink@unaffiliated/datalink) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
[11:15] <TeraX> yes and no :)
[11:18] * trijntje (~quassel@ubuntu/member/trijntje) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[11:18] * trijntje (~quassel@ubuntu/member/trijntje) has joined #raspbian
[11:19] * scubasonar_ (~Matt@99-108-165-58.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #raspbian
[11:23] * fmoreau (~fmoreau@au213-1-82-235-205-153.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:23] * scubasonar (~Matt@99-108-165-58.lightspeed.mtryca.sbcglobal.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[11:24] * fmoreau (~fmoreau@au213-1-82-235-205-153.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #raspbian
[11:26] <fmoreau> Hi. I'm using debian softfloat rootfs and I'm trying to chroot into another custom rootfs (armv7 soft float). But it fails, because executing any binaries in the custom rootfs segfault. Could anybody give my some hints ?
[11:28] * FruitLoop (~roland050@unaffiliated/roland0509) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[11:28] <raspier> ARMv7 instruction set isn't supported for native execution on the Pi
[11:28] * FruitLoop (~roland050@unaffiliated/roland0509) has joined #raspbian
[11:32] * damo22 (~damo22@adsl-mel-1-204.ozonline.com.au) has left #raspbian
[11:35] <fmoreau> raspier: ah... that's a good explanation :) so there's no way to use my custom rootfs on a rbpi.
[11:55] * bizarro_1 (~bizarro_1@57.Red-88-27-94.staticIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #raspbian
[11:58] <raspier> fmoreau: Not without an ARMv7 emulator
[12:03] * FruitLoop (~roland050@unaffiliated/roland0509) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[12:13] * Sv2 is now known as sv
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[12:17] * Davespice (~quassel@cpc13-haye17-2-0-cust146.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) Quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
[12:24] * Davespice (~quassel@cpc13-haye17-2-0-cust146.haye.cable.virginmedia.com) has joined #raspbian
[12:28] * flo|va-n1-pied is now known as flo|va-nu-pied
[12:30] * FruitLoop (~roland050@unaffiliated/roland0509) has joined #raspbian
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[12:44] * raspier (~raspier@62.254.209.225) Quit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
[12:47] * Holden (~holden@unaffiliated/holdenc) Quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
[12:56] * Datalink|Elsewhe is now known as Datalink
[13:10] * zicob (~zicob@modemcable202.167-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #raspbian
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[13:58] * FloJpg1 (~fpougheon@LAubervilliers-151-11-15-87.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr) has joined #raspbian
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[14:19] * Super_Dog (~ChuckMast@wsip-24-234-137-89.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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[14:46] * meti (~meti@gateway/tor-sasl/meti) Quit (Quit: f2edadas)
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[14:55] * marvinstuart (~marvinstu@cpe-184-57-132-151.cinci.res.rr.com) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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[16:15] * PasNox (~PasNox@beg33-4-78-237-93-55.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
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[16:31] * marvinstuart (~marvinstu@cpe-184-57-132-151.cinci.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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[17:01] * mythos (~mythos@chello080109227218.1.uni-klu.teleweb.at) Quit (Changing host)
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[17:59] * marvinstuart (~marvinstu@cpe-184-57-132-151.cinci.res.rr.com) has joined #raspbian
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[18:12] * aidalgol (~user@114-134-6-184.rurallink.co.nz) has joined #raspbian
[18:13] * redlob (~freenode@5352E83B.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl) Quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in)
[18:13] * bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
[18:16] * vagrantc (~vagrant@75-150-46-245-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined #raspbian
[18:16] * vagrantc (~vagrant@75-150-46-245-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) Quit (Changing host)
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[18:23] <plugwash> DAMN CHROMIUM
[18:24] <plugwash> build it with gold and it crashes, build it with bfd and my IMX board runs out of address space
[18:24] * daveee123 (~daveee123@ip-209-203.oberlin.net) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:24] * Syliss (~Home@168.244.11.3) Quit (Quit: Syliss)
[18:24] <plugwash> (when building for raspbian that is, building for debian armhf succeeded I guess because thumb2 code is smaller than arm mode code)
[18:26] * vagrantc cheers
[18:26] <vagrantc> about the linux-image package :)
[18:26] <plugwash> note: I haven't actually tested it yet, I just figured it had to be better than what was in there before
[18:33] * Supernova (~EyesIsMin@WiseOS/Founder/EyesIsMine) Quit (Quit: Infinity has collapsed.)
[18:46] * tinti (~tinti@maxtrack-F4-0-3-gacc04.bhe.embratel.net.br) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:46] * creemj (~mjc@60-234-221-162.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) has joined #raspbian
[18:47] * tinti (~tinti@maxtrack-F4-0-3-gacc04.bhe.embratel.net.br) has joined #raspbian
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[20:03] * fmoreau (~fmoreau@au213-1-82-235-205-153.fbx.proxad.net) Quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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[20:26] * marvinstuart (~marvinstu@cpe-184-57-132-151.cinci.res.rr.com) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[20:28] * aidalgol (~user@114-134-6-184.rurallink.co.nz) Quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs))
[20:41] * teepee (~quassel@p4FFFDE42.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #raspbian
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[20:44] * lupinedk is now known as Lupinedk
[20:51] * Garth (~Garth@196-209-247-145.dynamic.isadsl.co.za) has joined #raspbian
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[20:56] * ksclarke (~kevin@pdpc/supporter/active/ksclarke) Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
[20:59] <Garth> hello all, i received my pi yesterday and i'm getting on nicely. I have one issue, I want this machine to be all that a desktop could be and I want to be able to browse and then map or mount a network share that is on my iMac running 10.8. is there anyone who could help a noob?
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[21:18] <Shinda> hello
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These logs were automatically created by RaspbianLogBot on irc.freenode.net using the Java IRC LogBot.
